[EN] General bug reporting

[0dd1]

Hold on there. Placing references to other campaigns is ok, but there's no way we can synchronize everything in them to tell exactly the same story. American and Russian campaigns have their separate version of events and so does the Arabian one.

How does building New Kandahar makes no sense? Their attention is focused on siberite at that point, they couldn't find any around New Nishapur so they established a base somewhere they could mine it. The whole offensive is still going on behind the scenes, Heike has only been diverted from it, first by having to rescue a scientific VIP and then by securing Arabian access to the siberite. If it's not that apparent, then only some minor dialogue adjustments to make the player more aware of it, are necessary. And so then the Russians attack newly made Kabul and Heike is send there to help. Only funny thing there is that it makes Heike something of a one (wo)man army, because she is the whole reinforcements that are sent.

Besides, if Heike wold be captured on her way back from Russian territory in 06, then chances are so would be Bodenhof. Also, that would make only 2 mission gap between the cuscenes, which are sort of developing Heike's character, unbalancing the progress of the whole story.

[Krotos]

Hold on there. Placing references to other campaigns is ok, but there's no way we can synchronize everything in them to tell exactly the same story. American and Russian campaigns have their separate version of events and so does the Arabian one.

How does building New Kandahar makes no sense? Their attention is focused on siberite at that point, they couldn't find any around New Nishapur so they established a base somewhere they could mine it. The whole offensive is still going on behind the scenes, Heike has only been diverted from it, first by having to rescue a scientific VIP and then by securing Arabian access to the siberite. If it's not that apparent, then only some minor dialogue adjustments to make the player more aware of it, are necessary. And so then the Russians attack newly made Kabul and Heike is send there to help. Only funny thing there is that it makes Heike something of a one (wo)man army, because she is the whole reinforcements that are sent.

Besides, if Heike wold be captured on her way back from Russian territory in 06, then chances are so would be Bodenhof. Also, that would make only 2 mission gap between the cuscenes, which are sort of developing Heike's character, unbalancing the progress of the whole story.

Fair enough - I'd say the mission intro needs more dialogues regarding the siege of Lenin's as well as the mission itself in that case. Right now it's quite messy. I pointed it out mainly because a few people I talked to expressed the feeling of discontinuity between these two missions.
Regarding Ar08 - perhaps you're allowed to take 3 people with you, but you're excluded from important personnel like that Weaver, Aviradze, Bodenhof etc? Either make them choosable or assign some randoms given to her by Abdul.

Your remaining choices would be Lister, randomly generated characters, Kowalski and Leif Swanson. Oswald, Olaf and Ali might be assigned during the intro to some other place for example to ensure you cannot take them. Same about Kurt. Abdul might say that the forces crumbling around Lenin need backup and Kurt will lead them, taking most of the named, non-random characters out. This way you cannot lose them in New Kabul. It's just weird that Heike is the only one, who arrives there in order to reinforce it. Making it a small, 4-man squad sounds better.

By the way if you need any help regarding dialogues, typos etc. - feel free to PM me. I absolutely love Arabians and the way they play out in OW and would love to help you out. I noticed a few errors here and there (E.g. Oswald saying "your, Heike." in Ar09) and it'd be a pleasure to be able to assist you. You also seem to need a regular tester in general, something I could do for you as well.

[McBenn]

Added all the dialogues and stuff I mentioned earlier. Note that they are only in the English version. Not adding them to the other languages makes it easier for translators to pick up the new dialogues as I have made a tool that can track down missing dialogues and stuff.

don't forget to mention L.M. Kaganovich as well. Also any chance we could have Corporal Grishka present in Zhukov? He could have the very same line he uses in Ru03 to warn Kirov about the attack.

I couldn't find place for L. M. Kaganovich in the dialogues but the other bases are now mentioned. And I added Grishko to Ar05_cont with almost the same dialogues as he uses in Ru03.

Fair enough - I'd say the mission intro needs more dialogues regarding the siege of Lenin's as well as the mission itself in that case. Right now it's quite messy. I pointed it out mainly because a few people I talked to expressed the feeling of discontinuity between these two missions.

Things play out a little differently in this timeline as Heike isn't part of the siege of V. I. Lenin but she is still present in New Kabul when it falls. I actually never imagined that the Arabs continued the assault after the first push in Ar05 but settled down to fortify. The Russians attacking New Kabul was simply a delayed counter attack. But I see that it makes more sense that the Arabs do continue the assault to the point where they threat V. I. Lenin forcing the Russians to attack New Kabul as laid out in the Russian campaign. I have planted some hints in the dialogues of Ar07 and Ar08 (again, only the English version).

Regarding Ar08 - perhaps you're allowed to take 3 people with you, but you're excluded from important personnel like that Weaver, Aviradze, Bodenhof etc? Either make them choosable or assign some randoms given to her by Abdul.

All right, Heike now arrives with 3 other people (and that amount is ofc subtracted from the number of people already in New Kabul so the balance stays the same).

By the way if you need any help regarding dialogues, typos etc. - feel free to PM me. I absolutely love Arabians and the way they play out in OW and would love to help you out. I noticed a few errors here and there (E.g. Oswald saying "your, Heike." in Ar09) and it'd be a pleasure to be able to assist you. You also seem to need a regular tester in general, something I could do for you as well.

All and any help is much appreciated. There is a todo-list here https://forum.original-war.net/viewtopi ... =80&t=4069 (although a little outdated I see. I better update it). Proofreading is not part of the list but also nice to have. The texts are located at [mod folder]/Campaigns/Ar .
Generally testers are whatever people just happen to play the mod and care to post their opinion but more dedicated and focused testing is very welcome.

[Krotos]

I've read the To-Do List. As you pointed out, it's fairly outdated. I can do proof-reading as well as plot-related suggestions and bughunting.

I spend most of my time either on Facebook (where I can be talked to 24/7) and Steam. If you wish to contact me there, leave a PM.

@Ar08 - there's one thing more that slightly bothers me there. You get access to kamikadze apemen there, but it's not explained at all. It's a drastic move and there's no dialogue about it like there's one about stimulants (a really beautiful explanation btw). Do you plan to add any?

[0dd1]

@Ar08 - That was originally left a bit neglected, it was only at Ar13a or Ar14a that the self destruction and kamikadze were introduced. Naturally those cannot come before developing explosives in the first place, which happens in mission 08. After that there is no room to include Aviradze and specifically focus on the kamikadze tech. Hence I suggested once on owsupport to "just" introduce them in 08 along with the mines, to help with the mission difficulty. Without mortars there you really need to take all you can get, on hard difficulty (It also can help with mission 10).

[McBenn]

I can do proof-reading as well as plot-related suggestions and bughunting.

Please do
If it's not too bothersome I personally prefer to keep things related to OW on OWN/OWS, not to get too much mixed up. I can't speak for 0dd1.

@ Ar08 - Yes that tech has caused us some trouble. The problem is that we need Aviradze to be present and there is a gab from Ar08 to Ar10 where he isn't (those missions included). Ar11 is too late and in Ar07 you haven't researched explosives yet. So the best we could think of was to dump it in Ar08 without any further ado to help balance that mission out. If you can think of a better alternative I'm all ears.

[Krotos]

I can do proof-reading as well as plot-related suggestions and bughunting.

Please do
If it's not too bothersome I personally prefer to keep things related to OW on OWN/OWS, not to get too much mixed up. I can't speak for 0dd1.

@ Ar08 - Yes that tech has caused us some trouble. The problem is that we need Aviradze to be present and there is a gab from Ar08 to Ar10 where he isn't (those missions included). Ar11 is too late and in Ar07 you haven't researched explosives yet. So the best we could think of was to dump it in Ar08 without any further ado to help balance that mission out. If you can think of a better alternative I'm all ears.

@Ar08 - perhaps you could make it a secondary objective. One of the scientists - either in New Kabul or from the men you bring along as Heike - could mention that Aviradze was working on apemen neurology (be it in New Kabul or Nishapur) and they could use that research to develop something innovative, but extreme with a yes/no choice from a player.

Final 3 medals would be:
1. You fought until the end!
2. Russian supplies efficiently disrupted.
3. You developed a new and extreme measure of combat. (aka kamikadze apemen)

Currently there are 2 medals regarding the same objective from what I recall. This would alleviate the issue.

[0dd1]

@Ar08 the last secondary objective is for killing Yashin, so it's probably out of question. The explanation itself is nice enough though, and it shouldn't be a bother since there is already lots of optional things in this campaign for which there aren't enough medals. Like the stimulants in this mission for example.
It could be mentioned just at the beginning, because it's said Louis was already working on it, so they would be aware of the explosives tech before actually inventing it. And if it's supposed to be tied to Aviradze's work, it can be made available only if the ape vehicle was successfully constructed in the previous mission.

If it's not too bothersome I personally prefer to keep things related to OW on OWN/OWS,

It's not as though we have lots of new things to post every day. There's only so much testing and bugfixing you can do and once we really start working on the missions, things will get quiet and slow again.

All right, Heike now arrives with 3 other people (and that amount is ofc subtracted from the number of people already in New Kabul so the balance stays the same).

You might add something to the final dialogue in 07 as well, for example that Heike's crew needs to stay and guard the newly established siberite mine, and they can organize her backup in some other way (meaning Gensher). I always thought it's a little like in American campaign where JMM is told to go to Ovsyenko all on his own, and he gets his people directly from Alpha.

Your remaining choices would be Lister, randomly generated characters, Kowalski and Leif Swanson. Oswald, Olaf and Ali might be assigned during the intro to some other place

For the record, Kowalski and Swansson are just as much main characters as Olaf and Oswald.

About the testing, you might also help out with the upcoming last mission. We have most of the important things pretty much laid out (you can find it in the manuscript file in your mod folder), but there may be some room for new ideas. One thing in particular is that we planned to introduce some new novel artifact techs, so if you can think of anything cool beside what we have there, go ahead and post it.

[Krotos]

The idea to keep it locked based on Aviradze's research in Ar07 sounds good - one or two lines to connect both and we've got a solid explanation. Perhaps it could be Louis overhearing Oswald's joke about blowing the apes up back in New Nishapur and thinking about making use of that as an actual weapon.

Okay, it's just that Swansson just doesn't really get to say much (Ar06, that's it) and Kowalski says just 1 thing in Ar03 as I haven't seen him talking anywhere else.

AM/RU main characters have a lot more going on, although I can imagine that you don't want to make it too relation-heavy given the nature of a mercenary army.

[McBenn]

@Ar08 - Hm not a bad idea. I've always thought it was odd for Aviradze, that ape-lover, to invent kamikazis so letting the bomb-freaks build on his tech is perfect. I'll see what I can do.

You might add something to the final dialogue in 07 as well, for example that Heike's crew needs to stay and guard the newly established siberite mine, and they can organize her backup in some other way (meaning Gensher). I always thought it's a little like in American campaign where JMM is told to go to Ovsyenko all on his own, and he gets his people directly from Alpha.

Way ahead of you. Did that as part of the change

Okay, it's just that Swansson just doesn't really get to say anything at all and Kowalski says just 1 thing in Ar03 as I haven't seen him talking anywhere else.

IIRC Swansson was kinda thrown into the campaign by a request (don't remember from who atm) so he's not that well integrated when it comes to dialogues. As for Kowalski, yes you are right. I haven't given him that many dedicated lines. The good explanation would be that he's the silent, "just following orders" kind of guy. The realistic explanation is that I have failed a bit there hehe.

[Krotos]

I see. Swansson has the looks of a scoundrel and I could see him as a mix of Farmer and Weaver's lover - a nasty womanizer that is fairly repelling in a bad way rather than a comical one.

The other direction could be going after his mechanical skills and making him a bit like Swansson from Starcraft - the go-to mechanical mastermind of Arabian workshop machineries. It'd also make sense that he's in a group with Bodenhof, a scientific VIP, whose area of expertise is radars, remote control and high-tech, opto-electronic research.

I'm going to spend my evening reading through texts for all missions. I'll send the corrections to mission dialogues in a PM.

@Regarding naming bases in Am11: I was looking through both forums and haven't found any thread for small suggestions. I suppose I should make a separate thread for it in that case?

Would you prefer fixed dialogues to be sent as pure text in a message or as attached .wri files?

Speaking of dialogues and such - I know Backero did most of the Polish translation for you, from what I'm aware of, but Odd and I can do it as well, McBenn.

[0dd1]

@Ar08 you could say the scientist in Kabul was previously working on a team led by Aviradze, before the main attention of the Arabian command fell on the siberite.

Way ahead of you. Did that as part of the change

Still, there's nothing specifically instructing Heike to go alone. Might mention that as well.

I think Kowalski had enough dialogues and can be left alone. Not less than some of the others in any case.
I thought the easiest explanation of Swansson "silence" is because he is the silent type. Already made a small mention about him being a hunter of some sort, which might fit the idea of a scoundrel (and maybe a bit of a loner), though he shouldn't be too much of a mercenary type since he doesn't join Legion.

Krotos was the name of the base in Ar14 intro supposed to be "Dammam"? Your post above was somewhat confusing.

I have the access to the mod repository as well and can implement even small changes as soon as I see them. It's not a big deal. Depending on how much corrections you propose, you can send a corrected file to either of us or even post a single line in a translstion topic here on forum (there is one for Polish at least).

[McBenn]

AM/RU main characters have a lot more going on, although I can imagine that you don't want to make it too relation-heavy given the nature of a mercenary army.

We have tried to make some character interaction but we may not have succeeded as well as the original campaigns. I'm open if you have some ideas on this. It would only improve the campaign I think

Still, there's nothing specifically instructing Heike to go alone. Might mention that as well.

Ah well okok. Will do.

@Base names - Try asking Antitheus where would be most appropriate.

[Krotos]

Krotos was the name of the base in Ar14 intro supposed to be "Dammam"? Your post above was somewhat confusing.

Yes, New Dammam was supposed to be the name of that base in Am11. I suggested using New Riyadh in Ar14 instead to imply the base is bigger as the other two aren't there in the intro, although I guess it should remain New Dammam for consistency's sake.

I have the access to the mod repository as well and can implement even small changes as soon as I see them. It's not a big deal. Depending on how much corrections you propose, you can send a corrected file to either of us or even post a single line in a translstion topic here on forum (there is one for Polish at least).

Basicly I'm going to go through every single mission, intros included, and apply fixes to whatever typos and mistakes I come across. I've already gone through Ar01_cont and fixed 7 mistakes in what is less than 5 minutes of gameplay. The corrections are mostly grammar or typo fixes, as the structure of the sentences is usually kept in good shape. Keep in mind I'm doing those for English ones, not for Polish as I prefer to work with that language in general.

Also since the scale of this may end up being bigger than you might suspect, I'll PM it to McBenn as attachments of .wri files together with changes included for each .wri file.

[McBenn]

Antitheus has done a great deal of Polish translation as well.

The .wri files usually don't change very often, and the changes are small. I would prefer you just make the corrections directly in the files. Then I'll just merge them with the ones in the repository. That ofc means I and 0dd1 should keep our hands off the .wri files as long as you are working but that shouldn't be a problem. I'll go through the changes when I make the merge to make sure nothing is lost along the way.